You initiate a turn by leaning... ummm..

[Toadman]

WRONG! This is in the safety booklet with the owners manual for my '06 VTX. Initiating a turn is by applying pressure on the inside bar where you want to go(countersteering, but very subtle) which tilts the bike's CG. The harder you push, the steeper the lean initiated and sharper the turn angle with the following body weight shift.

Take your hands off the bars during coasting and try to steer the bike with your hips and weight shifting only.

I'm kind of upset that someone would publish this for new riders. It's the same as riding a bicycle. Maybe the concept of countersteering is too confusing but I feel it should be mandatory.

*steps off soapbox* :)

[Big-X]

Here...I have an icon for you. :)

http://members.iinet.net.au/~vroncol/Smiley_gifs/soapbox.gif

Good post.

[FL_VTX_GA]

Just pulled out the MSF booklet that came with my '03 1800C.

"To get the motorcycle to lean in a normal turn, press the handlebar in the direction of the turn" etc.

Did Honda decide to save money by including a Safety Booklet by other than the MSF? Sounds like it might have been written by a government agency.

Jay (in Florida this month)

[Blue]

Actually the statement is correct. The turn is initiated by the lean, and the lean is initiated by countersteering.

[Blue]

Here...I have an icon for you. :)

http://members.iinet.net.au/~vroncol/Smiley_gifs/soapbox.gif

Good post.

LMAO .. Here's one for you :)

:stirpot:

[Toadman]

A lean can be initiated by a countersteer, taking the path of the bike off vector. It's just so subtle at speed you don't recognize the bar pressure you exert to initiate it, like riding a bicycle. The lean "catches" the change in direction. Leaning the bike by shifting your weight is like steering a plane with only the rudder. Interesting topic and sorry about the soap-box post, lol!

[FL_VTX_GA]

...and a countersteer is initiated by a desire to turn and a desire to turn can be initiated by...

[Blue]

...and a countersteer is initiated by a desire to turn and a desire to turn can be initiated by...


a police check point, low fuel light, or a good looking chick :icon_cigg

[DillDawg]

I'm kind of upset that someone would publish this for new riders. It's the same as riding a bicycle. Maybe the concept of countersteering is too confusing but I feel it should be mandatory.

These aren't bicycles silly Toadman :icon_evil
Try and steer a motorcycle like a bicycle and you'll end up in the trees.

Look left, press left, go left
Look right press right, go right.

Basic MSF course 101.
If you havn't taken the saftey course - it may benefit you
Here's a little reading for you
http://ridemyown.com/articles/riding/BTB-countersteer.shtml
He also sells a very good training video.

[Toadman]

35 years riding here but I'm considering the advanced MSF course to brush up, especially with this 600lb bike with pegs way out front instead of under your center of gravity. :)

We're not discussing basic steering technique but how a turn is initiated on a two-wheeler. Bicycles steer exactly the same as motorcycles, countersteering with less mass so it's subtle. Is it the chicken or the egg(i.e. lean/weight shift or the countersteer)? Or a little of both but in which order?

[2FS4LV]

Man you guys need to just ride. Whether its the look, press, lean, or whatever. we all know how to get there. I don't have to show my work anymore, teach. I have been out of school for some time now. :)

[DillDawg]

Man you guys need to just ride. Whether its the look, press, lean, or whatever. we all know how to get there. Pardon me for posting an opposing viewpoint.
Just trying to keep a noobie who may happen upon this months from now, and figure it was correct to try and "steer" a mototcycle like a bicycle - when in fact, turning is accomplished by countersteering.

Is it the chicken or the egg(i.e. lean/weight shift or the countersteer)? Or a little of both but in which order?The countersteer initiates the turn....and you can actually countersteer and lean the opposite way to keep your bike more upright under questionable traction.

Class dismissed!! :choppersm

[Toadman]

Awww, can't I stay after for extra credit to discuss that cross-wind skill? :D
But like 2FS4LV said, let's forget the physics and just ride! :) :choppersm

[NC Hammer]

It was so windy yesterday, that I had to 'countersteer' to go straight.

Just thought I'd add my $.10 (inflation).

[Mal]

Figured I'd throw my hat into the fray:hmm2: ....

here's a site I found to be really handy for this type of discussion .... In a nutshell, the bike goes where it is "leaned". Countersteering helps a bike to start a lean faster.

http://www.msgroup.org/DISCUSS.asp

[texas-neo]

Damn, I thought I knew how to turn till i started reading this post. Now I'm confused. I better get on the bike and go practice. :)

[roadhag]

holy jeez....am so glad i live down here on the coast...not many benders around here, so....i can just go straight for awhile...stop...get off...turn the bike around....get back on...use the right hand and repeat the process......LOL!!!!

[ROSHOLT1]

You guys just keep it up we still have a foot of snow on the ground in Northern Wisconsin, I wish I could go out to practice steering I can only go out to the garage and sit on my bike and make vroom vroom noises.

[roadhag]

In all seriousness this is a most excellent post that provokes a little bit of
thought..........but therein lies the danger, at least for me. If i start going into a
turn now and start thinking about this process I am either gonna fall off the bike
on one side or run off the road on the other side....so at least for now, I prefer and choose to be brainless and mindless as I approach a turn and will let the laws of physics rule

[roadhag]

Uh....????? now was that countersteer then lean or
lean then countersteer....holy jeez, gravity WORKS !!!!

(pics from killboys site...and ouch for the rider....hope all ended well for ya dude)

[KenDoll]

This has been quite the hilarious discussion. :drunk: I've always thought that it just comes naturally. I've been on motorcycles since 8 years old so maybe I've forgotten the technicallities. Good to remember.