[Heidenreich12]

So I ended up finding a thread that was nearly identical to mine as far as problem over at the OA.

Bogging Down at Highway Cruising -- Steady Speeds

So currently I'm running cobra exhaust, and trying to tune in a Cyclehouse Q5 intake. I had done the pair valve removal previous to this as well. I first started off with a DJ kit, and the largest jet they had in the kit was a 210 and it wasn't getting enough fuel. I read around this great site and realized I bought a dyna-crap kit. So I purchased the Factory Pro Stage 3 kit and was hoping it would solve my problems.

Currently I have a FP #225 main jet, #58 Pilot, and running the DJ Needle at the last shim. I had the same setup with the FP needle and the needle was just to long, and when changing it to the DJ (as someone had done previously on this site), it has gotten the best results so far.

So now It's running perfectly fine under 40 and when you accelerate it's getting a ton of power, but when I go to cruise at high way speeds, it starts to bog out. The larger the jets I keep putting in, the better it's getting. It just doesn't seem to be getting enough fuel. Reading around it looks like I could use a #60 pilot, and was thinking I may need a #230-#235 main jet.

Wanted to get your guys opinions on the matter since it doesn't look like to many people have needed such a large main jet, though there is also a ton of airflow with that intake.

Thank you!

 

[Charlie D]

bogging at cruise is the needle position.
You may want to go to a stock slide spring too as the one in the DJ kit is to light and allows for more problems when the wind enters the Q5

If the FP needle doesn't fit on the 5th position you need to clip the tit more on the retainer or you can grind a little off the blunt end of the needle.

 

[Heidenreich12]

bogging at cruise is the needle position.
You may want to go to a stock slide spring too as the one in the DJ kit is to light and allows for more problems when the wind enters the Q5

If the FP needle doesn't fit on the 5th position you need to clip the tit more on the retainer or you can grind a little off the blunt end of the needle.

Thanks I'll give that a shot then. I forgot that I had the DJ spring in there, as it looked identical to the stock. Wasn't aware that it was lighter.

The reason I thought it was a jet issue was because we tried the 5th position with the FP Needle, and it still was bogging. Would the spring make that much of a difference?

 

[Charlie D]

The bogging is caused by lean setting at steady throttle.
The spring keeps the slide piston from oscillating at steady throttle positions.

You need to do everything in the proper order or you will chase your tail.
http://www.vtxcafe.com/showthread.php/45937-carb-and-what-affects-what

 

[Heidenreich12]

Thanks for that link. Reading Through that, it still looks as if I may need the #60 pilot as well with the amount of airflow I'm getting. Do you think this would be wise?

 

[Charlie D]

The 60 will help balance things out but remember to set the A/F correct with it and don't use the A/F to mask other problems.

 

[Heidenreich12]

great, thanks for all the help. It looks like the person who owned my bike before me had put in a dynojet kit because the needle looked almost identical, as well as the spring. Hoping the stealer has a spring in stock to try out.

 

[Heidenreich12]

So I ended up following the carb guide and it was very informative. I found that somehow the rubber connecting the choke to the carb was lifted and was causing many of my problems earlier.

I went ahead and ordered a 60 pilot jet and put it in, and tweaked some of the other settings.

I'm currently running the following:

Main Jet - 215
Pilot Jet - 60
DJ Needle - 5th shim
A/F - Almost 2 turns

I had these exact same settings with the factory pro needle at the 5th shim and it was leaning out more so than the DJ Needle.

Currently now, it is getting lean surges around 50-65 (cruising speeds), but not as frequent as when the FP Needle was in.

I'm not sure exactly what my next step would/should be to get the cruising speeds to stop leaning out, and it would be much appreciated.

Also, I took the long part of the main jet out (the piece the small jets screwed into), and noticed it was kind of bent. I am planning on ordering a replacement but would this be causing the issue as well? I appreciate all the help!

http://i.imgur.com/kttp3.jpg

 

[Charlie D]

So I ended up following the carb guide and it was very informative. I found that somehow the rubber connecting the choke to the carb was lifted and was causing many of my problems earlier.

I went ahead and ordered a 60 pilot jet and put it in, and tweaked some of the other settings.

I'm currently running the following:

Main Jet - 215
Pilot Jet - 60
DJ Needle - 5th shim
A/F - Almost 2 turns

I had these exact same settings with the factory pro needle at the 5th shim and it was leaning out more so than the DJ Needle.

Currently now, it is getting lean surges around 50-65 (cruising speeds), but not as frequent as when the FP Needle was in.

I'm not sure exactly what my next step would/should be to get the cruising speeds to stop leaning out, and it would be much appreciated.

Also, I took the long part of the main jet out (the piece the small jets screwed into), and noticed it was kind of bent. I am planning on ordering a replacement but would this be causing the issue as well? I appreciate all the help!

http://i.imgur.com/kttp3.jpg

replace that tube (called emulsion tube).

 

[nacraracer]

Sounds like you are having the exact problems it was having (surging at cruising speed) After a 62 jet I finally gave up and went back to my Spyker mod. Still get a little surge from time to time. I honestly believe that it's the DG spring that the stealer installed on it. Oh well, maybe deal with it next year. Sure was a sate of money on that spike air filter.

 

[Donut]

You said the needles looked the same. Just for clarification FP needles have 5 clip groves. And the DJ has 6 clip groves.
The stock main spring is 7.5" long.
And now I return you back to Charlie D.

Donut/Doug

 

[Heidenreich12]

You said the needles looked the same. Just for clarification FP needles have 5 clip groves. And the DJ has 6 clip groves.
The stock main spring is 7.5" long.
And now I return you back to Charlie D.

Donut/Doug

Yes, I went and ordered a stock spring from the dealer and the person I bought the bike from definitely had put a DJ Kit it in. It had the DJ Spring and Needle when I took it apart. I may have miscounted what I said on the previous post, but it was the fifth on the FP needle, so I guess I didn't count when I put the DJ Needle in, so it is actually at 6 shim on that needle currently.

The reason I put the DJ needle in instead of keeping with the Factory Pro was due to the DJ Needle being smaller/not as long. So it is letting in more fuel than FP Needle was able to at its highest setting (closes to point). I did see that some grind down the needle a bit, or have even added extra shims. Would any of this help you think?

I appreciate you putting a name to that piece, the "emulsion tube". Will order one tomorrow.

Not sure how something like that would get bent. Do you think this would cause any performance issues related to my issues?

Thanks for all the great help.

 

[Charlie D]

emulsion tube mixes air with the fuel as it passes the needle.

As far as the FP needle it passes more fuel over a broader range then the broom stick shape of the DJ.

You need to go up in main size if the FP needle has to have the clip on the 5th position.

 

[Heidenreich12]

emulsion tube mixes air with the fuel as it passes the needle.

As far as the FP needle it passes more fuel over a broader range then the broom stick shape of the DJ.

You need to go up in main size if the FP needle has to have the clip on the 5th position.

Great, I appreciate the response. I read in your carb post about the needle and pilot determining cruising speeds, so wasn't sure if putting a 220 in would help with the highway/cruise speed issues. I'll go ahead and up the main jet and see how that effects things, and get a new emulsion tube ordered tomorrow. Thanks!

 

[Heidenreich12]

So it looks as if my choke is messing things up here...possibly. I have the A/F screw turned all the way in and the bike runs (shouldn't be possible, correct?). I have tried to wiggle it around and it sounds like its about to die when I move it in certain positions, but then won't. It there something I can do to make sure this choke is going off, and not staying on? Could this be what's screwing up all my attempts at a proper tune?

Also, what is there that I can do to tighten or adjust it? Not sure what my options are for that as I've searched and doesn't look like others have had this problem.


Thanks everyone for all the help

 

[Donut]

on the back side of the choke knob there is a tension nut.
Now .. The a/f are you getting it mixed up with the idle adjustment knob between the two right front cylinders. Just checking here because the a/f is up under the carb and hard to get at especially without a special tool or adding glens permeant a/f adjuster. Some in the past get the a/f mixed up with the idle adjustment , and I'm not sure this is in your case. But of you are using the choke then probably the a/f is too lean and the idle may be set to low.
only use the choke open 1/4 " .

 

[Heidenreich12]

on the back side of the choke knob there is a tension nut.
Now .. The a/f are you getting it mixed up with the idle adjustment knob between the two right front cylinders. Just checking here because the a/f is up under the carb and hard to get at especially without a special tool or adding glens permeant a/f adjuster. Some in the past get the a/f mixed up with the idle adjustment , and I'm not sure this is in your case. But of you are using the choke then probably the a/f is too lean and the idle may be set to low.
only use the choke open 1/4 " .

I have the glen's A/F adjuster (thank god)...and I have the choke all the way pushed in. I unscrewed the nut on the choke lever and dismounted it and fiddled around with it but it seemed to be pushed all the way in. When I would push the the wire from the choke going into the carb with a screwdriver while hte bike was running it would almost turn off.

Am I right by thinking it shouldn't be running at all with the A/F screw turned all the way in?

It seems like the choke is holding on somehow

 

[Donut]

I have tried to wiggle it around and it sounds like its about to die when I move it in certain positions, but then won't. It there something I can do to make sure this choke is going off, and not staying on?

Also, what is there that I can do to tighten or adjust it? Not sure what my options are for that as I've searched and doesn't look like others have had this problem.

Thanks everyone for all the help

Snug the choke knob so it stays in. Now if it wants to die when you push it in then the idle is set too low. Set the a/f first at 2-1/4 to2-1/2 and leave it there with stock jets. After that now raise the idle up. check to make sure the choke knob stays in.

Donut

 

[Vinish]

Did you by any chance take the carb apart before all this began happening? I ask because I had very similar symptoms to yours after I took apart every tiny part of my wife's carb on her 1300R. The culprit was I got the similar looking springs reversed in the accelerator pump and the fuel cut-off when I put it back together.

G'day,

Vinish

 

[Heidenreich12]

Snug the choke knob so it stays in. Now if it wants to die when you push it in then the idle is set too low. Set the a/f first at 2-1/4 to2-1/2 and leave it there with stock jets. After that now raise the idle up. check to make sure the choke knob stays in.

Donut

My problem is I am wanting it to die because I think the choke is staying on when I don't want it to. I have the A/F at 0 turns. So at 0, with the choke completely off, wouldn't the engine not be able to start? I was just wanting to test to see if the choke is in some way staying on when I have the knob pushed all the way in, and I only set it to 0 to test that. Hopefully I'm making sense, but let me know if I'm not.

Also to Vinish, I haven't completely stripped down the carb, just enough to be changing out jets and needle position. Thanks for the response tho