[the_mav]

hey guys, i think i'm having a big issue now....
everything is stock on my 2007 S bike, aprox 10k miles. full tank of premium gas.
didn't run her for almost 5 weeks, the temp outside went from 20-24 celsius to aprox 4-5 celsius overnight, kept the bike in a closed garage.
anyhow: this evening the battery was almost dead (odo didn't light up, the engine didn;t turn, etc). i gave her current from my car, she started fine; despite i'm having glens' a/f opened for 2 turns, she didn;t kept the idle so i used the choke (DON'T KILL ME PLS... i didn;t fouled the plugs, i've checked them !).
i pushed back the choke and bike almost died, managed to keep her from the throttle for half a minute but died... had to give current again from the car, started fine, (so yeah - the battery is flat , although it's having only 3 months!!!) and NOW THE PROBLEMS BEGAN:
when i started to put back the battery and i touched the ICMv - BANG!!!! bike started to spur, misfire, front cyl didn't worked, black smoke from the exhaust, sputtering, etc - all the hell took over my bike !!!.:banghead::banghead::banghead:
turned it off. started again from my car. barely touched the ICM and again the bike went crazy.
i pushed the bike back to the garrage, took off the battery to charge it, i stopped investigating the ICM wires issue (green, black,wrench-tightened battery , etc) as the night came.

questions:
1. why it didn't kept the idle speed? (despite glen's permanent being installed and tuned)
2. everything being stock, why the battery run flat in almost 5 weeks of not being used? (where the h**l went the current from the battery?!?!?!?)
3.can someone help me with an ICM scheme?
4. IF the green, black or other wires are broken (inside the insulation, outside, etc) HOW AM I GOING TO SOLVE THIS ISSUE ? i assume cutting the any wire from some place and replacing it with another one wouldn't be a solution....:banghead:
5. what else might cause the black smoke?
thank you guys once more for your help... any suggestions would be much appreciated

 

[The Old Fool]

I'm betting on the black and green wires. However, tighten the battery cables really snug first. If the ECM wires are broken, you can extend them using a jumper wire soldered in place. If you have a friend that knows electronics/wiring get him to help you. It takes a special tool to get the pins out of the electrical plug. Pretty simple if you have the right tools.

 

[Donut]

Sounds like you have two problems.
Week battery - possible one cell is going south. Also check the fluid level in the battery - yea I know it says do not open - be careful with the acid,wear safety glasses and don't wipe your hands on your pants.

ICM - take two safety pins an do this to each wire separately Black,Green).

Shove one safety pin into the ECM plug and peel back the harness casing about an inch and then shove the other safety pin threw the casing of the wire and connect a jumper wire between the safety pins. Start the bike and see if it runs OK if it dose then disconnect the jumper wire and if it starts to miss you have found the break. Do this with the black wire then the green.
With a small screwdriver or a pick you can get the pin out of the connector.

Donutatriot:

 

[Gonzo1970]

Sounds like you have two problems.
Week battery - possible one cell is going south. Also check the fluid level in the battery - yea I know it says do not open - be careful with the acid,wear safety glasses and don't wipe your hands on your pants.

ICM - take two safety pins an do this to each wire separately Black,Green).

Shove one safety pin into the ECM plug and peel back the harness casing about an inch and then shove the other safety pin threw the casing of the wire and connect a jumper wire between the safety pins. Start the bike and see if it runs OK if it dose then disconnect the jumper wire and if it starts to miss you have found the break. Do this with the black wire then the green.
With a small screwdriver or a pick you can get the pin out of the connector.

Donutatriot:

+1

The ECM's have a known issue with the wires breaking. I am most certain this is your issue. This -could- also be contributing to your other issue.

As far as your initial symptom of not wanting to run, this isn't abnormal for below freezing weather. It is a little hard to get them running and stay running when its under freezing. This is normal for any carb'd bike.

If it is tuned "perfectly" (jets and intake matching, A/F correct, etc.) it is still a little difficult to get running. With mine (tuned properly) I goose the throttle 2 times and hit the button. It starts, but doesnt like to run.. fluttering the throttle immediately will probably kill it. Start it again, and once it gets to the point where it will idle high, I lock the throttle and let it idle high. It wont take much more than about 20 seconds of fluttering and restarting to get it to idle high. Thats about as good as its going to get for us.

-Gonz

 

[Donut]

I agree with Gonzo.
No carb engine is going to run smooth when it is cold and the colder it is the worse it will be. Normal.
I would run 87 octane rather than premium gas though.
You may want to open the a/f up to closet to 2 1/4 to 2.5 turns.
If you have to use the choke on the enital starting only pull it out 1/8" to 1/4" and no more and after it starts push it in after about 1/2 minute and then lightly use the throttle to to keep it running, I use a throttle lock (a Breakaway expensive but the best).

Donut atriot:

 

[the_mav]

Thank you guys, will do it those days.

@gonzo:"As far as your initial symptom of not wanting to run, this isn't abnormal for below freezing weather. It is a little hard to get them running and stay running when its under freezing."

we were having around 5-6 Celsius, that means around 40F... not below freezing, that's why i was surprised for the bike to have the same symptoms as it was started during the winter time... probably was related to not being started for a month i guess...

have another question in mind: what's each of the the green / black wires controlling?

 

[Gonzo1970]

Looks like the Fuel Cut Off Relay, Regulator/Rectifier, Side Stand Switch, and the Engine Start/Stop Switch.

Basically, if the wires are cracked, etc. it runs like crap.. Backfires, Black Smoke, etc. etc...

-Gonz

 

[BigJon]

About the battery; sitting for 5 weeks in the cold can kill a battery. It may not hold a charge now and a weak battery can cause other issues like burning up the starter solenoid.
Might want to replace it.

 

[Donut]

About the battery; sitting for 5 weeks in the cold can kill a battery. It may not hold a charge now and a weak battery can cause other issues like burning up the starter solenoid.
Might want to replace it.

Starter solenoid (relay's) rarely go bad. One in 8 years on three boards.
Donutatriot:

 

[BigJon]

Starter solenoid (relay's) rarely go bad. One in 8 years on three boards.
Donutatriot:

You're kidding. I read about the solenoids burning out all the time. It happens so much, there're posts with part numbers for cheaper replacements. You must be thinking of something else. Problems on this board alone http://www.vtxcafe.com/search.php?searchid=4515419

 

[Charlie D]

If the battery is low or dead the bike will not run.

As for the starter relay the 1300s seem to hold up better than the 1800s and the op has the 1300

 

[DaytonaVTX]

I'm glad I only have to deal with cold like that for a few weeks a year.

 

[mooneydriver]

[
have another question in mind: what's each of the the green / black wires controlling?[/QUOTE]

This is for the 2007 VTX 1300 S model!
This is the way I interpret the schematic.

The "Black" is is the fused hot 12 VDC feeder to the ICM.

Dark "Green" is the ground from the 14 pin Ground Junction to the ICM.

Blue/Yellow is return from front ignition coil.
(pulse generator with flywheel triggers ignition to fire)

Yellow/Blue is return from rear ignition coil.
(pulse generator with flywheel triggers ignition to fire)

Green wire & White/Blue pulse voltage from Ignition Pulse Generator.
(voltage to ICM to fire coils)

Black/Blue wire, Red/Yellow wire and Yellow/Red is from Throttle Position Sensor.
(advances ignition electronically)
atriot:

 

[the_mav]

thank you guys for your posts, tmrw morning i'm on it to solve the issue...
i'll keep you posted

 

[Bassdude404]

I would run 87 octane rather than premium gas though...

Ditto...Premium fuel is a big waste of $$....

 

[the_mav]

I would run 87 octane rather than premium gas though.

Donut atriot:

over here we're having from 95 octane up.... up to around 100-102, so....

anyhow guys... the story was like this: sat morning, on 37 degrees F, at 7 o'clock i took it out of the garage, and start looking with open eye + magifing glass + led headlight +etc to all the wires of the ICM... NOTHING !!!
my friend arrived with the battery fully charged, we put it on started the beast and was running like crap .
took donut's advise and started to implement "safety pin plan" - NO RESULT !!! i mean either with connection through safety pins, either with normal wire: same thing! running like hell...

ok, i took it from my garrage to a friend's motorbike service (sat morning through the middle of the capital city) when the bike started to have some ENORMOUS BACKFIRES like i never ever heard before anywhere !!! of course, in less than 2 min the police was behind me, wanted to serve me a ticket for excess noise... clearely was running in one cylinder
anyhow... 10 miles in 2 hours and i arrived to my friend's service... he started methodically and first took out the plugs from both cyl: all of them seems to have a rich mixture (blacked)... then he started to check "old fashion way" if each of the spark plugs were running: SURPRISE ! front left was dead, although i changed them 1000 miles ago!
changed that ****** spark plug and the bike runs like a charm...

thank you all guys once more for the help :cheers:

 

[mooneydriver]

Glad to hear that you are up and running. I would look into why the plug is failing, A/F need adjusting, plugs range out and etc. Wishing all well.